A question about the future 64 bit build

[Ookami]

As one of the latest news posts said that the game would enter into 64 bit build to deal with the super crashes.

Does that mean those of who have 32 bit OS computers are in short, screwed and we're stuck playing basically a version that will probably not be updated or will there be 2 builds?

1 for 32bit and 1 for 64bit.

I kind of have the need to ask this as no one else has and since I have a 32bit system and I'm not about to go out and get a new PC any time soon.

[rowdyyobbo]

I really like this game, even in this development state. I see that there is a push to go to a
64 bit build to address the memory issues that (I think) are causing a lot of the crashes I see.
I have 32 bit Windows 7. Once the 64 bit build is shipping, will there be a build that I can play?

[Tolwrath]

I believe another benefit of using 64 bit is that it will allow the devs to eventually add multi-threading, which will make the game run better on multi core processors (for example my CPU is a 6 core). Personally, I think the industry is shifting towards a 64 bit standard, and moving away from 32 bit. So if you emd up getting a new machine at some point, the 64bit version should fit you well. I'm unsure about whether it'll continue to be available in 32bit, as the main issue is the amount of data this game has to store in memory for handling squads separated into distant areas, and handle all the NPCs.

[Ookami]

Well another way to deal with memory is to have the game purge the memory that it is storing and not using, so it can reuse that memory when it's needed instead of having it build up. Certain areas and things may take a bit longer to load in, but it would help with the memory a bit.

An example being that if I have have all but 1 guy at my outpost, and the other guy is at a city. If I (the player) am at that city, the memory containing the area where my outpost and other people are should be purged. I am no longer there and thus, it should not be stored.
When I go back to my outpost, it may take a bit longer to 'load' in the area, but that's generally the only downside I see.

I'm not a game developer, so I have no idea how it works.
I know another game dev was having a problem with memory with his game, so he decided to have the game to purge memory every five minutes or so. And that's really where the idea came from.

Unless that's already being done.

Now I wasn't saying going to a 64-bit build is bad and shouldn't be done. I'm just a little concerned over whether or not I'll be able to continue playing once it's done.

I would rather not end up with another "Watch_Dogs" and I can't play it because it's for 64-bit systems only and basically feel like I wasted my money since I won't be able to play Kenshi until... probably another year or two down the line when I'm able to get a new computer.

Honestly, I can live with the Super-Crashes. So long as they stay around 2-3 hours apart like they have been... and after 2-3 hours, I usually have stuff to do, so I usually take it as the game telling me to get stuff done around the house.

[rowdyyobbo]

I'm with Ookami, I would like to play the game even if I have to deal with some crashes, or turn down some features. I also probably won't be able to play the game for a while if it goes 64 bit only.

[hugeknight]

IMHO i believe this game should start dropping the shackles that are 32-bit will make the game way smoother easier to play. Im no game designer but isnt it easier to port something to 64-bit in the earlier stages than trying to adapt a completed game?

[Hatsune_Neko]

IMHO . Im no game designer but isnt it easier to port something to 64-bit in the earlier stages than trying to adapt a completed game?

it could be related to cost.
and back when Chris started working on kenshi 32bit was the programing of choice, 64 bit was just coming out more or less.
now everyone is changing over to 64bit because its the programing of choice. and most people now have over 12gb in ram on average instead of the 2 or 3gb back then.

[BloodyNex]

I believe another benefit of using 64 bit is that it will allow the devs to eventually add multi-threading, which will make the game run better on multi core processors (for example my CPU is a 6 core). Personally, I think the industry is shifting towards a 64 bit standard, and moving away from 32 bit. So if you emd up getting a new machine at some point, the 64bit version should fit you well. I'm unsure about whether it'll continue to be available in 32bit, as the main issue is the amount of data this game has to store in memory for handling squads separated into distant areas, and handle all the NPCs.

Actually, multi-threading's been done since 16-bit Windows. It's not exactly new, it's just a lot of extra potential problems to undertake. One major issue is the accessing of memory; if one thread tries to read a value while another thread is writing to that value, there will be problems. There are ways to handle it (mutexes, semaphores, etc.), but those introduce the possibility of locking things up when two threads try to access two or more of the same values. When one thread needs access to a value, it "locks" it to tell other threads not to interfere with it yet. So if a value locked by one thread is needed to continue processing in another thread, the second thread waits until that value is unlocked. The problem there is that if the second thread has already locked a value that the first thread needs before it can unlock the value the second thread is waiting for, both threads wait indefinitely.

Long story short, multi-threading is hard and extra time-consuming to get right. I'm guessing the biggest problem is that it's already coded using single-threading, so converting to multi-threading is a huge task. But dual-release for 32- and 64-bit wouldn't be all that difficult, most coding environments let you setup different configurations for situations like that.

[f03n1x]

Hey people, haven't posted anything in awhile but I read this and thought I'd reply,

As one of the latest news posts said that the game would enter into 64 bit build to deal with the super crashes.

Does that mean those of who have 32 bit OS computers are in short, screwed and we're stuck playing basically a version that will probably not be updated or will there be 2 builds?

1 for 32bit and 1 for 64bit.

I kind of have the need to ask this as no one else has and since I have a 32bit system and I'm not about to go out and get a new PC any time soon.

The thing about 64 bit in this case software and operating systems, is that if you look at the history of all operating systems, 64-bit was actually supported quite a while back. (For Unix, according to the Wiki page I have open it says the first 64-bit operating system was supported back in 1985), anyways point being is that you won't have to get a new computer, in most cases, unless you have a very old fossil of a computer (I guess older than 2005, again according to this Wiki page), you'll only have to get a new operating system, if you're a student chances are windows 8 and windows 7 are totally free.


So there really isn't much to worry about. Also if you're not a student you can buy a one time use of windows 7/8 for usually a fraction of the retail price (due to most retail prices being 3-4 time uses and designed for family computers). I bought my copy at a PC hardware store, I'm sure it's the same for everywhere else in the world, probably a lot cheaper than New Zealand is .

Sorry for my little of text. I guess the alternative is like what BloodyNex said building the game in 32 bit and 64 bit versions of the game.

[Ookami]

Hey people, haven't posted anything in awhile but I read this and thought I'd reply,

The thing about 64 bit in this case software and operating systems, is that if you look at the history of all operating systems, 64-bit was actually supported quite a while back. (For Unix, according to the Wiki page I have open it says the first 64-bit operating system was supported back in 1985), anyways point being is that you won't have to get a new computer, in most cases, unless you have a very old fossil of a computer (I guess older than 2005, again according to this Wiki page), you'll only have to get a new operating system, if you're a student chances are windows 8 and windows 7 are totally free.


So there really isn't much to worry about. Also if you're not a student you can buy a one time use of windows 7/8 for usually a fraction of the retail price (due to most retail prices being 3-4 time uses and designed for family computers). I bought my copy at a PC hardware store, I'm sure it's the same for everywhere else in the world, probably a lot cheaper than New Zealand is .

Sorry for my little of text. I guess the alternative is like what BloodyNex said building the game in 32 bit and 64 bit versions of the game.

Well been awhile since I had internet again...

I use a fossil for my gaming purposes. Especially when my fossil can run games made today and it doesn't even meet the minimum specs. (Which is surprising every time)

As for simply getting a new operating system... again, I have a fossil, I think it was made in 2003 or 2004. The entire thing would have to be replaced. It's a mush of parts at this point and with my luck, I'd have my system give me a constant BOSD because 'some' part doesn't agree with the 64bit OS.

Not saying it 'will' end up that way, it's just the way my luck tends to go 90% of the time.

Now back onto topic.
With the recent news... it doesn't look like there will be dual OS .exe's for both systems since it wasn't mentioned at all, but I could be wrong and be pleasantly surprised.

[McDerp]

Hey Ookami! If you need help picking parts for a new PC feel free to PM me with your budget and the State/Province/Eurocountry you live in and i can help you out. I can make you a battlefield 4 machine that'll ring you up less than $400CAD.

Imo to fully appreciate your hobby you need to spend some moneys on it to get the most out of it, as with most things in life i guess.

When cars started increasing in size and frame strength and all the little AMC gremlins were getting squished because they were made out of paper and spit, i'm sure gremlin owners were cheesed. At that point however, most of them opted for something sturdier and safer.

Just keep in mind a fresh copy of MS windows 7 will still be around 100$, which is lame-o.

Other than that man, technology changes over the years. I can't expect my current system to play the new games that will come out in 5-6 years with no hitches. If it did, i'd be concerned that we've reached a technology development finality, and that would suuuuck, but at least there wont be an iPhone 433, it'll stop at 432. Again, feel free to PM me if you want help building a new system at some point.

[Captain Deathbeard]

Here is the official reply:

1 - Yes we will also maintain a 32-bit build, but it will still have the super-crash problem.
2 - If you still have a 32-bit OS then I hate you.
3 - Just kidding, I don't hate you, but all hardware is 64-bit nowadays so its well worth upgrading your OS anyway.
4 - Just kidding, I do totally hate you.
5 - Kenshi is partially multi-threaded already, it needs at least 2 threads to run properly, preferably 4, but it still has the main bulk of it's work going on in the main thread.

[Butta]

Do 2 builds mean that the progress of the game will slow down?
I'm not sure how time consuming it actually is.

[Mattk50]

usually both builds end up packaged in the same installer. depending on the engine setup it will add minute to significant compile time, but that shouldnt cause too many problems..